Nigel Farage has said he “frankly wasn’t listening” during a conversation with his former chief of staff and an undercover reporter discussing what appears to have been a scheme to funnel foreign money to Reform UK.
His former chief of staff Dan Jukes and ex-head of policy James Orr have both been removed from their jobs after an investigation recorded them talking about how to get money to the party from an American donor and asking a fake company to pay for polling.
Jukes has denied doing anything wrong. Orr has told Sky News he will co-operate fully with Reform’s internal investigation.
In an interview with the BBC, the Reform leader said he was not listening to the discussion and revealed his family are “begging” him to leave his job amid increasing pressure.
Under electoral law, donors to UK political parties must be a UK registered voter, or a company registered in the UK, so cannot give money from abroad through a British resident.
The proposed donation was never made as it was part of an undercover sting, but that it was seemingly entertained has sparked questions.
When asked about the exchange by reporters at Reform’s party conference on Friday, Farage said he was questioning whether the arrangement was above board.
In an interview to be broadcast on Sunday with Laura Kuenssberg, he has now said: “I am not a compliance officer. I was in the middle of canvassing in the Clacton by-election. I turn up. I frankly wasn’t even listening.”
“I was told there was a global family office based in London, so the money could have come from Singapore,” he said of the conversation in the Channel 4 film.
Channel 4/Verbatim“The money could come from all over the world, you know. Income could have came from all over the world into a family office based in London. I know electoral law. I know donation law better than anybody.
“Frankly, the two individuals involved here have never been involved in fundraising before and they shouldn’t have been involved directly in fundraising. They should have done basic checks and nobody, nobody should be brought to me, unless they’ve been vetted from.”
The row over the Channel 4 film has threatened to capsize Reform’s conference, with Labour and the Liberal Democrats calling on the Metropolitan Police to investigate the claims. The force is assessing whether or not to investigate.
Jukes and Orr – both senior figures in Farage’s inner circle – have stood down pending the outcome of the party’s internal investigation, but political opponents are demanding that Farage is investigated and takes accountability.
Farage categorically denied that Reform had ever taken money from a foreign entity by channelling it through a UK donor.
But as pressure ramps up on Farage in the latest crisis to rock Reform, he also told the BBC that “for the first time”, he does not have his family’s support to be in politics.
“They would rather I packed it up and walked away,” he said.
He added he had not considered standing down, but “when you’ve got your family begging you to, it’s not easy”.
Farage also condemned the hundreds of masked “stop the boats” protesters who descended on the Port of Dover on Saturday morning, causing major travel disruption.
Farage said he “deplored” anyone wearing masks or balaclavas at public demonstrations.
He added: “You should not be allowed to be masked up, balaclava-ed up and go out and protest on the streets of our country. It is wrong at every level. So I deplore what is happening in Dover today.”
Speaking after watching the interview, Business Secretary Jonathan Reynolds said: “For a political party that don’t like foreigners much they do seem to have a soft spot for foreign cash.
“We have rules in this country about how our democracy works and everyone has to stick to them.”
He added: “I think you see someone struggling to decide whether they’re really serious about trying to run for power or want to keep the protest going.”
Analysis: Farage may have to pay more attention
There’s no question the allegations in the Channel 4 film have been embarrassing for Reform, and disrupted what they hoped would be a conference about their plans for office if they win the next General Election.
Everywhere around the huge, draughty exhibition hall in Birmingham are giant posters and placards saying, “Reform – the first 100 days”.
They wanted to herald their deal with a serious contender to be the next French President, Jordan Bardella, to deal with small boats.
They were keen to highlight the promise to cut income tax if they win the election, scheduled to be in 2029.
They wanted to talk about their proposals for education, welfare, planning, and the rest.
Party members, delighted to have a reason to get together, have taken part in those sessions, applauded and cheered in the hall; gone wild for Farage on stage.
But for the rest of the country, most of the noise from the conference will have been the huge and awkward story about the toxic mix of politics and money.
What is harder to assess is the impact this mess will have on Farage’s standing with the public, after a tricky summer and a recent poll slump.
At the top of the party there is a quiet admission that what has happened here is a genuine mistake.
One senior figure told me they could brush off other claims of murky funding, confident nothing had gone wrong – but they conceded these claims do matter, and that for a certain vital percentage of voters, it would “cause them to ask questions”.
No one is pretending it’s just what Farage tried to joke was a “little, local difficulty”.
And there is a private acknowledgement that stories like this can be off putting to voters beyond Reform’s no doubt very enthusiastic base.
Another party source told me they were “totally blindsided” by the revelations; stunned “there’d just been no diligence” and in disbelief at how Jukes and Orr, who both say they’d done nothing wrong, seem to have behaved.
A different member of the party’s top team said, “hopefully, it’s just growing pains”. In other words, Reform’s developed so fast that sometimes mistakes are made. But they told me: “The party has to step up – sometimes the people that got us here, aren’t the people for the next stage”.
Among Farage’s fans at the conference, I found different views. One member was convinced the party is treated unfairly: “It’s the blob, it’s all against him,” she said.
But another young Reform enthusiast rejected that, telling me: “It’s all documented and there on camera – Nigel has to be more careful about what party members say.”
But there is a sense of “here we go again”. When I asked another member what they thought of the financial scandal, a weary answer, “Which one?”
This time last year in the same conference complex, Reform felt like they were simply sweeping all before them. Twelve months on, they are having to work harder, the scrutiny is more intense, and the pressure only growing.
Farage’s claim that he “wasn’t listening” to the conversation was telling – to get to power without more of these kinds of serious embarrassments, he may have to pay more attention to what is going on.
